This month was a special month for the show as we got to announce that we have a new sponsor for the show, First Horizon Bank. To celebrate that we welcome Evan Moss from the local branch to discuss finances and your mental health. We then followed it up with the topic of Emotional Freedom. Do you think you have emotional freedom, or do you know how you can go about getting it? Then we finished the month by talking about how when you get hurt by others it is not your fault.
What did you think about the shows? What kind of rabbit hole with Adam take us down this month?
Tune in to see the September Month in Review Through a Therapist’s Eyes.
Think about these three questions as you listen:
- How does finances affect Mental Health
- How to manage finances to improve mental health
- Marriage and finances… is there a connection
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Episode #246 Transcription
Chris Gazdik: [00:00:00] Hello there. From Through a Therapist’s Eyes where you get insights directly from a panel of therapists in your car and personal time at home. We are hitting you on September the 29th. I am Chris Gazdik joined for the September month in review by Mr. Adam, the man, the myth. The only ’cause it can’t be replicated.
Clogger, how you doing, man? Do you like that? That good, man? But that’s 28th. 29th. Eighth,
Adam Cloninger: eighth.
Chris Gazdik: Ooh, then I’ve done my progress notes wrong all day long.
Neil Robinson: we won’t tell anyone. You can fix ’em. Let’s just consider you’re just ahead of
Adam Cloninger: schedule. I am ahead of the
Chris Gazdik: game. You really I’m ahead of the class. Yeah, I really can’t count like that. Suddenly, I don’t feel like I am though. Thank you for the try though. Yeah, no, I misdated all of my progress notes today.
That’s
Adam Cloninger: the only reason I know I had something I [00:01:00] paid today. Well, I actually paid it. Yeah, I paid it. Did it today. It’s going to come out tomorrow. Tomorrow’s the 29th. So tomorrow is… Yeah, I like chicken.
Chris Gazdik: Oh, that’s not right. Yeah, because today is the 28th. Anyway, and Mr. Neil comes out of the closet, man. How are you?
Neil Robinson: That’s not the right phrase. That’s the wrong phrase. That’s the wrong phrase. He comes from behind the curtain. Yeah, behind the curtain. Yeah. How’s your wife, Neil? She is fantastic. I love her. She loves me. It’s everything is fantastic.
Adam Cloninger: He comes out
Chris Gazdik: of the curtains out of the closets on the month in review to join us in his thoughts that he had all through the week.
So did you have a good week, Neil?
Neil Robinson: It was good. It was actually a good week. I recovered from my run and you know, I’ve been getting work done. So it’s been a good week. Yeah,
Chris Gazdik: you did a run. I’m so proud of you. I’m not. You’re in pain. Did it hurt bad?
Neil Robinson: Not bad. It’s just, you know, you get older, you start recovering a little bit [00:02:00] longer.
And so,
Adam Cloninger: but yes, wait, man, do what I was saying?
Chris Gazdik: Just, Oh, I know it hadn’t really I started yet for him. I mean, well, I mean,
Neil Robinson: I did just turn 40 literally like a week ago, so it started, I started, you know, that was my birthday gift for my son. Like let’s sign up for a four mile trail race. You want me to die? I don’t have good enough insurance yet.
Come on. Come down, kid.
Chris Gazdik: Yes. 4. 5 miles. That’s impressive. I don’t know that I could do that when I was 40. That would have been, that would have been definitely a challenge. I think you, Mr. Athlete over there have no problem doing pushups or running 4. 5 miles. I
Adam Cloninger: couldn’t run that anymore. There’s no way. Yeah.
Yeah.
Chris Gazdik: No way. Humbling, isn’t it? I’m actually trying to get my kid out to do some trail running before he goes to the military. He’s going to the Navy. I’m very proud of him. We got a final date for that, by the way. Oh. Whew.
Adam Cloninger: December. December 4th. Oh, I thought it was 5th.
Chris Gazdik: December 4th. Yeah. Coming up very
Neil Robinson: soon.
Is he going up to Chicago for the… Yeah. Yeah. My buddy… That I went to high school with, he was in the Navy, and I actually did a road trip with him, his father, and a family [00:03:00] friend up to Chicago, we drove all the way up there, and on the way back, I scared the crap out of them, because I’m like, I just want to get home, so we’re going down the mou West Virginia mountains, and like, driving, and actually, Chicago, it was pouring down, I’m driving through Chicago, like, just Windy City.
Yeah, it was It was fun for me, but I wasn’t, I was the one driving West
Adam Cloninger: Virginia.
Chris Gazdik: Mountains are fun though. Yeah. Driving through West Virginia is a blast. Yep. What’s that? Oh yeah. heading up there. Yeah. You know those hills well now, don’t you? Yeah. Yep. Say hello to Julie. You’re going to go see Julie. Hang out with Miss Julie.
So guys, listen, we’re doing this September month in review where we did three of the shows, mental health and finances. And the second one was emotional freedom, which I think was a really, really kind of cool show. And what was the third about you don’t have the third, second page. Oh, it’s flipped. You you’re
Neil Robinson: so efficient.
I saved paper at home.
Chris Gazdik: It was something about being hurt. We talked about last week, hurt by others. It’s not your fault. So these are [00:04:00] really pretty cool. Themed shows that I think that we did, but Adam, I think what you don’t know that’s might be news to you is the finance kind of piece. It’s connected to the first show that we did with Mr.
Evan Moss joined us to kind of formally announce that we have a show sponsor. Did you know that? Is it WWE? It’s not ww
Adam Cloninger: you, you mentioned wrestling. I’m trying, I’m trying to, how did I, how did wrestling
Chris Gazdik: come into this? When did we,
Adam Cloninger: I don’t know. You said wrestling camp and you said oil got something to tell you about.
I’m like, I thought you were, I dunno. Oh, well, it was
Chris Gazdik: random. Not connected to wrestling.
Adam Cloninger: Okay. Yes. Yeah, I just thought it was,
Chris Gazdik: we have a show sponsor, first Horizon Bank, not to be confused with Hearst Horizons. Neil, don’t do that. Don’t do that. I know you want to. First Horizon
Adam Cloninger: Bank, is it like a First Horizon Bank?
Is it like a specific chain or is it the.
Neil Robinson: The entire,
Adam Cloninger: the
Chris Gazdik: entire, the entire bank is a sponsor of the show now. Very proud to announce that this month. And they are check them out. Really. They got lots of branches where they headquartered actually. Neil, do you remember?
Neil Robinson: I have no clue where the headquarters.
I just know [00:05:00] there’s one here. There’s I saw one in Hickory. That’s up that way. Like now you see. So yeah, it’s that whole yeah, now, now I see them.
Adam Cloninger: Yeah. Yeah.
Chris Gazdik: They’re, they’re, they’re growing in this particular area, but first horizon bank is a, is a really cool banking system. Pretty big in, I really kind of feel like they’re, from Texas.
Yeah, Google that. Where’s, where’s First Horizons headquarter? We should, we should know that anyway. Anyway, they’re really cool bank. They have a small town neighborly feel. The branch that’s right down the road from the office here is where I met Evan. He come on the show and he talked to us about mental health and finances and their impressive outfit.
They’re relaxed to work with got good financial products. He talked a lot about financial literacy. We’ll do that with the review of the show, but how cool is that? We have a new show sponsor. Cool. Very happy to announce that. Do we have a headquartered man?
Neil Robinson: Not, not yet.
Adam Cloninger: Gimme a second. Slow on the
Chris Gazdik: phone or waiting.
’cause we, Memphis move on. Memphis, Memphis, Tennessee,
Neil Robinson: Memphis, back in 1864. 18 six. Seriously? Yeah. That’s what they’re, that’s what they’re about us
Chris Gazdik: as. [00:06:00] Okay. First Horizon Bank from 1874. In Was that was
Adam Cloninger: Bill. Was it?
Chris Gazdik: Yeah. Do you think he robbed them? No, that was before Billy
Adam Cloninger: the Kid.
Chris Gazdik: Well, do you think he robbed them?
No.
Adam Cloninger: Well, I guess he could have. Yeah. Because he was, I think his first shot was 1870.
Chris Gazdik: He did some stuff around Tennessee, didn’t he? Matter of fact, Billy the Kid got, I’m thinking of another gangster. I don’t think so. Got nailed, I think it was further west. Oh, it did a lot more west, but then they came back east.
Oh, I don’t know. To do the family, at least as the movie goes. Alright, we are rambling at this point, so let’s get dialed in. So, so on the month in review, we like to start out with Down the Rabbit Hole with Adam. So he introduces us Topic of craziness that he kind of came around. That’s the way I’m going to call it.
Yep. Topic of craziness that is related to mental health in some way, stuff that he has seen along his travels of the last month. So what you got Neil or [00:07:00] Adam. So,
Adam Cloninger: There was a show that came out originally in 2019. It was on history channel. It’s now being shown on discovery plus. The show is, there’s some speculation the show was cut, no longer continued after the first season because it may have been too violent.
The show is called Night Fight.
Chris Gazdik: Never heard of it. Never heard of it, it’s good, I hope
Adam Cloninger: you haven’t. Have you heard it before? Night Fight? Night Fight. Heard of Night Court? No. Night Fight might be about? Speculating Night Fight.
Chris Gazdik: What do you think, Neal? I’m thinking… Well, without
Neil Robinson: seeing the word, it could go either direction, but I’m thinking Medievals.
Adam Cloninger: Yeah, so they have, they have, there’s a league. Wait a minute, I get
Chris Gazdik: to guess, don’t I? Well, yeah, go ahead. I’m thinking there’s a
Adam Cloninger: league. Yeah, that would be a correct guess. Okay.
Apparently this is a big thing, especially in Europe. They have like the league, and they have like a… I’m thinking like
Chris Gazdik: Kumite? They have like an [00:08:00] organization… Kumite or Kumitai? Is it the fighting…
Neil Robinson: Think of like real world LARPing. Like literally like LARPing with real weapons. Do you know what LARPing is?
Chris Gazdik: No, that sounds fast. You know what LARPing
Adam Cloninger: is? I don’t know, but we can hear about
Neil Robinson: it. Okay, LARPing is live action roleplay. But so you have these people who cosplay or dress up in certain things. Think of like Lord of the Rings or whatever. They dress up and then they hit each other with like cardboard or like, like safe weapons.
Yeah, it’s not like that at all. So it’s basically real because I think I’ve seen some, a snippet, but they literally like dress up in full armor.
Adam Cloninger: They have 80 pounds of armor on, they have Rules. They have an organization, they have an organization that has it. And I read some of those, the weapons I use are legit.
I know you’re thinking they don’t use swords and staff. No, everything has to be has to be have a minimum of two millimeter thickness all along
Chris Gazdik: the back to medieval times and stuff. But I only got the swinging
Adam Cloninger: stars. Oh man. I saw some of the time. I mean, these people are getting hurt. I mean, it’s, and one guy actually said that his team’s motto is he said, he [00:09:00] said If you hurt a man bad enough, he, he’ll sit down and not get back up, or sit down and won’t fight back.
Chris Gazdik: Right, if you hurt a man bad enough, he’ll sit
Adam Cloninger: down and won’t fight back. Yeah, I, I, I guess, no, I haven’t actually, I just saw the preview, I haven’t
Chris Gazdik: actually watched the show. So, before you pose your question, or, or hit us with what the heck you’re thinking, Neil, this dude’s like, got like, anger clubs, he’s got like, you know.
Rage rooms. Rage rooms now we’ve got like, night fighting that we’re. Yeah, that’s, that’s, the
Adam Cloninger: rage room is kinda why this, I brought this up.
Chris Gazdik: Ha, ha, ha.
Neil Robinson: So KNIGHT There’s some hidden stuff going on with Adam that he’s Underneath that cool demeanor We
Chris Gazdik: need to check out his history, his his internet history Do I
Adam Cloninger: need to go back to Orcas now or something?
Chris Gazdik: Oh yeah, then you got like cocaine bears and stuff, remember that story not too long ago Cocaine sharks Sharks, sharks, the sharks, yes Cocaine bears Okay, sorry, So
Adam Cloninger: I guess my question to you is, since…
So they really do this? This is a… This is
Chris Gazdik: a league that literally dresses up like a knight… Yeah, they’ll have… [00:10:00] And fights…
Adam Cloninger: This team versus this team, they’re in… From what I saw the preview… Kind of like an octagon, but it’s, you know, not really an octagon, it’s like wood walls or whatever, and they have, they have full armor on, and I see this guy with an axe coming, hit the guy in the, in the rear, I mean, just, hit him in the ribs, and the guy goes down, yeah so I’m thinking, You know, like I said, I’m speculate that it, it got discontinued because it’s kind of violent.
It really is. Yeah. What country was this in? Well, it’s big in Europe, so, okay. I don’t know. Some country in Europe. I got, remember I just saw a preview. I haven’t watched the show, but I’m going to. Okay. Okay. But I did, I mean, saw the, I saw the preview, then I started doing research on the rules and about the weapons and stuff and kind of, I said, ah, this is a good topic.
So this is kinda why the other night. You were thinking, well, I’m trying to tell you about my MMA show, and you’re just talking about… He’s talking about some MMA that was really good. You reminded me of it. The fight that you watched that was so…
Chris Gazdik: Oh, yeah! Oh, the [00:11:00] last MMA fight.
Adam Cloninger: So then I’m like, then I’m like, oh man, I got a topic, I can’t wait.
He says, I’m trying to tell you about my MMA, and you’re just changing the subject. I’m still thinking, I’m not really changing the subject, you’re just reminding me of my topic.
Chris Gazdik: So… Nice,
Adam Cloninger: nice. So my question to you, Chris, so since you’re a proponent of the Rage Rooms…
Chris Gazdik: I wouldn’t say that. You
Adam Cloninger: are
Chris Gazdik: a It’s an interesting concept that’s faddish
Adam Cloninger: that’s probably going away.
Since you’re an oxytocin junkie from hockey, football, and MMA, is it healthy to watch something like this?
Chris Gazdik: Oh, interesting question. You know, I’m gonna put a yes out there. Does that sound like it’d make me a horrible person? I’m going to put a yes up
Adam Cloninger: there. No, if you said no, then you had to explain why you said no because you got the other way.
Yeah.
Chris Gazdik: Yes. You know, it’s interesting because I was just I was, I was watching a little bit of the Rogan show recently and he was talking about how, you know, [00:12:00] the, the fighting sports, the arena type, you know, I love UFC, you know, the, the fighting, the fighting arts, the fighting sports, martial arts, all of those things are, are pretty amazing if you think about what, you know, human experience is.
You know, I think we got to be careful about the barbaricism. I mean, you know, back in the days with the gladiators and stuff, people were literally fighting lines and dying and being killed. And there’s a lot of grotesque middle age kind of stuff. So, you know, I think you gotta, you don’t want, you don’t want that type of.
That can be downright traumatic to watch and stuff with people. But, but as an outlet, I love football. I mean, football is pretty much gladiator sport, man. My watching a football game with my kid the other day and he’s like, dad, this is, he’s getting a little new to it. He’s like, dad, this is hazardous. Yeah.
And it is. I mean, you know, we, we, we enjoy boxing and fighting and collisions and, but we want to make it safe. So I think it’s a great outlet. Yeah.
[00:13:00] No, I, I. I, I think so. What do you, what are you thinking, Neil? Let me, let me toss it over.
Neil Robinson: I think, I think, I think it’s really, I mean, I don’t think there’s any problems with that.
I was thinking about, cause I was thinking about, cause you have people that really can’t stand watching those. Cause like the impacts, the watch that it really drives them crazy. But then you watch all these other shows, like your big brothers and those like shows where there’s these conniving backstabbing type of things.
And those really irk me, those bother me, but yet it’s not physical violence. And it’s just weird that personality of like, some people are okay with physical violence, but not okay with like. The emotional deceit kind of stuff. But yeah, some people don’t care what they hate physical violence. But I think it’s, you watch guys that are basically, you know, like you talked about with fighting, like they’re prime, you know, they’re in good shape.
They’ve honed their craft, their skills, especially when you get weapons, like those skills of doing it. Like, I don’t know if these are like major masters, but you have people that are really good at wielding swords. And I think. Honestly, I, I think it’s healthy to watch stuff like that [00:14:00] because everyone, it’s all volunteer.
Everyone signs up for
Chris Gazdik: it. It’s interesting. As I’m listening to you, Neil, give me a moment to think. You see on YouTube, I got a book I’m holding up. It’s a really, really cool book. Colonel Grossman, if I’m correct, Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman wrote a book on killing, and it’s a fascinating, he, he ends up going through really studying the psychological.
Aspects of killing because he’s a is a doctor’s level psychologist as much as he is a Retired colonel and I believe what is colonels and not the army. I think that’s army colonel. Anyway He really took a deep dive on things like the Revolutionary War and the Civil War eras and various engagements And and how people struggled to follow through with actual killing behaviors but But he also talked about in modern day, how removed we are from things like killing the pig for dinner on the farm, right?
We, we’re so removed [00:15:00] from various normal parts of the human emotional experience, I would. And with that removal, it beco
or, you know, somehow, you know, we have a denial of the fact that we actually do this. Like, human beings do get angry and fight. Human beings are sexual. We, we tend to subvert, you know, killing and violence and anger and sexuality.
And it’s a part of human Existence.
Adam Cloninger: I wonder if humans kind of act out more because we’re not doing the normal day to day Killing the pig
Chris Gazdik: or there’s a lot of legitimacy to that. Yeah, it’s suppressed And comes out in our emotional experience and then and then thus be behavior so I don’t know if I want to go so far as to say we all got to watch fight nights, but You know, or night fighting, but you know, it’s definitely, Oh, I can show him, I’ll show you the preview.
Be like, Oh my God, I got to watch that. Oh, I totally got to see it. Totally want to see this. I’ll put it on my [00:16:00] phone so you can see it. It’s gotta be a must see. All right, let’s go on to the shows. We got mental health and finances with Evan Moss. We talked about episode 243. Very cool. Like I said, he introduced First Horizon and is the sponsor of the show.
And I thought, you know, we really need to have you on and talk about what. financial health really is. And so I don’t know, Neil, what did you think? I think that, you know, he really talked a lot about you know, the financial literacy that they talk about on the bank. That was his his big kind of angle and helping people with finances and walking through the stress that they feel and, you know, making things less of a mystery.
You know, that helped with You know them being helpful for the first horizon, honestly, like they care about guiding people, but what, what, what, what was your takeaway or thoughts about our conversation there? Do you remember it?
Neil Robinson: I think, I think the interesting thing about it, cause I know you were talking about it cause there’s a lot of, when you deal with finances, it’s very, it can be very stressful, especially if your finances aren’t what you [00:17:00] expect them to be.
And I think the one thing that. You know, everyone talked about with his branches, the, the environment that he’s created at his, at the branch, you walk in and it’s very calm there. Everyone’s very helpful. It’s like it deescalates. If you’re going in there with a stressful situation, that whole environment’s helping them deescalate before you can get to that point.
And he understands that. That’s what makes it. Right. And that’s what he talked about in that whole situation. But, you know, education, literacy was a huge thing. Understanding finances, you know, having Victoria on part of the panel and her being so young and not understanding some of these things or You know, the discussion of Dave Ramsey and his ideologies and the stuff that he goes through.
It’s very interesting hearing the younger generation. I say that now that I’m 40,
Chris Gazdik: you know, happy birthday belated, by the way. I don’t think I’ve said that to you. So
Adam Cloninger: it’s not today. Is
Neil Robinson: it? It was last Friday. Oh,
Adam Cloninger: no one’s joining
Chris Gazdik: me. No, we’re not. Adam, you let me know, man. [00:18:00] Say the next line. Do you know the next line?
I didn’t hear where you were at. Happy birthday, brother.
Neil Robinson: But yeah, I think that’s definitely one of those things that de escalation, understanding the seriousness of it, but yet also how education plays a part into it. Knowing what you should be doing or not be doing. You know, he was big on budgeting and understanding where your money is going.
You know, that’s… A big thing in today’s society that people don’t do. Adam,
have
Chris Gazdik: you ever heard of Dave Ramsey’s program and the Financial Peace University? Yeah, you’ve mentioned it before. Okay, oh, so you’ve heard it from me, yeah. I’ve only heard it from you though, so it’s not like I’m… So, and I think that’s been very brief then, hasn’t it?
So, so it’s kind of a show a couple of times. Yeah, I have purposely because it is in my mind, it’s, it’s a part of what I call the trifecta three really impactful things in the mental health realm that. That I have really wrapped around and one we all know is emotion focused therapy with marriages and attachments [00:19:00] second is love and logic with parenting relationships and how that guides the
Facilitation of really kind of connecting and the third is this Dave Ramsey thing and Neil we didn’t get to Talk about it very much on that show.
That was a, that was a big, a bummer that I wanted to cover a little bit. That’s a good wrap up. It really is. Yeah. That’s one of the reasons why I like doing this review show, because there’s sometimes things that we just don’t get to when we, when we did the show. And I think you’re very familiar with Dave Ramsey, right?
Yeah, I’ve
Neil Robinson: actually gone through when I was younger right with I think before my wife actually I actually went through financial university with my you know a Fellowship I used to be a part of and yeah went through the whole whole spiel with everything and there’s a lot of Good points in the financial peace University.
It’s you know, the one thing you talked about was taking the emotions out of your finances That’s one of his Key things. That’s very
Chris Gazdik: important. The element I feel like that enables you to have conversations with your spouse about budgeting, like that’s the whole [00:20:00] people get out
Adam Cloninger: of shape easy. Oh man. Take offense and be, you know, thinking you’re attacking them.
Chris Gazdik: Everything else. It’s disabling. It’s disabling in, in marriages. I mean, you know, when you, when you can’t have conversations about finances and that’s why I was really surprised we, we were going to do maybe not quite to the level of night fighting, but I wanted to have a throwdown with Victoria because she was like, no, I don’t really like Dave Ramsey stuff.
And I was like, okay, not John. Then you gotta be on the show, but we didn’t really get to talk about it. Did we? Well, I thought the
Neil Robinson: interesting part about Victoria with the whole thing was she was, it was because of her parents pushing Dave Ramsey on her that she didn’t like it. That’s right. It wasn’t because she disagreed with him.
It wasn’t because she like, I don’t want to. She felt pressured. She, because her parents suggested it a lot, she didn’t want to hear it. And that’s the whole parent child thing. Now, her friend’s saying, Hey, you should watch this. He’s a really,
really smart stuff. He helped me get my finances in check. She’d probably watch it not be a thing, but that’s a parent child dynamic more than [00:21:00] anything.
But when you look at Evan, his top three things were on par with what Dave Ramsey talked about with your budgeting and setting goals and stuff like that. Those
are
Chris Gazdik: some of the financial literacy basics, right? Exactly.
Neil Robinson: Yeah. And that’s, it really is. It’s doing what he like setting up everything and having that plan in place.
It’s a very simple plan. I mean, if you know what you, you get 1, 000 in savings to start with, you have steps, you start knocking down your debt, you do the debt snowball. Once you get those things cleared away, then you do, you know, three to six months, you know, and then at that point, then you start investing.
You, you start your breakdown of your 10 percent in step four, 20,
Chris Gazdik: 76, or like, yeah. Same for college for your kids,
Neil Robinson: right? You go through that whole thing. And so there’s, it’s a very conservative, very
Chris Gazdik: last. Pay off your house. Is that where’s where’s pay off your house? Get to, do you remember like six or
Neil Robinson: seven steps?
Yeah, I think pay off your house is a really, because of the way the interest rates have become, it’s really such a low debt, like it’s really [00:22:00] low when it comes to what you can invest with versus how much you’re paying
Chris Gazdik: free money at like two, 3%, of course, now it’s like five, six,
Neil Robinson: yeah, now it’s more, but that’s the idea is like the house was always kind of like that if you, if you pay it off, that’s fine because that’s considered kind of good debt as opposed to credit cards, which are.
Crap debt. Really bad. And so it’s very simple and then the idea is you use your budgeting to figure out how much you’re spending and then you realistically say okay, I can actually save this much. You know, Victoria’s comment about, well we can’t get enough money together, my husband and I are working more now and not
Chris Gazdik: make…
Both of you and I, both of you and I jumped out of our chair like, well that’s…
Neil Robinson: And, and I’m not saying I’m great at saving right now, but I understand that when you go through the process, you could probably save a lot more than you think
Chris Gazdik: you can. Absolutely can. And Adam, so you’re not as familiar with the Dave Ramsey program.
I mean, one of the things that’s really, really awesome about people identify through going through the class is budgeting is really important. But [00:23:00] he, he, he has a process that guides you through with the, the spousing. relationship. One is a nerd and one is a free spirit. The nerd is the person who’s, you know, got the budget and, you know, the spreadsheet and is managing things and tight, you know, with, with following, you know, the rules we set up together and wants to talk about it.
The free spirit is like not even wanting to show up for a conversation and just freely spending You know, being mindful, probably underspending and being careful, not necessarily impulsive. That’s not the implication, but they’re just not wanting to sit down and talk about meeting and stuff and budgets and following tight, tight rules.
And so it’s, it’s like correlates perfectly with the emotion focused therapy where you have the abandonment person in the engulfment person. And I have found a high, high correlation, not a hundred percent, by the way, but. You know, the abandonment persons tend to be the nerd. Where they’re budgeting and they’re pushing conversations and wanting to, to do this and, and the engulfment persons are pretty much the free [00:24:00] spirit where they’re just, just let me be free.
I don’t want to deal with all this. Don’t restrict me. Let me, let me do my thing, you know, and and he facilitates conversations with them. It’s, it’s really. That’s the impressive part to me. That’s really the important part. Cause yeah, like you say, Adam, otherwise people are ready to go to a night fighting.
Yeah,
Adam Cloninger: I mean, I know people that just, you know, that don’t even want to discuss anything at all. I’m like, you know, don’t want to discuss, Oh, well, what bank did you use for your loan? Oh, don’t talk about that. Oh, I see what you’re saying. It’s just, you know, the stuff that doesn’t mean anything, you know,
Chris Gazdik: very, very proud.
So, so
Neil Robinson: good. Right. Yeah. So are you good at budgeting? You seem like someone though, I don’t know why but I don’t know if it’s just the fact that you painted your lawnmower or not But you just seem like a good budgeter Cuz I’m not I’m a horrible budgeter. I am NOT good So but yeah, you seem like someone that would probably follow Dave Ramsey.
You’d probably do really really good at it. Well, I mean [00:25:00]
Adam Cloninger: you know, my dad was a He’s a general contractor and I went to school for realtors stuff and I understand amortization. I used to do accounting.
Chris Gazdik: So see, I’ll make a confession when I don’t understand people, for instance, that don’t balance their checking account, like to the penny, like I can’t comprehend why you would not do
Adam Cloninger: that.
I used to, but then I finally got to point. I didn’t do it anymore. You know why? Why? Because I think that it’s important. My time is more worth is worth more than that hour of me trying to figure out that what that 20 or 2 and 17 cent was
Chris Gazdik: Interesting. How long have you stopped doing that? Oh,
Adam Cloninger: it’s been probably 10 years ago 10 years ago, right?
Yeah Yeah, I have a I have an adjustment guy called foobar now
Chris Gazdik: In your, in your do you use accounting software? Yeah,
Adam Cloninger: I don’t, I don’t even do that anymore. I just, you don’t even do that. But I think,
Neil Robinson: but today’s different now. I mean, the fact that you can literally go to your bank account on your phone and just know what’s coming out, what’s pending, what’s not going through where before, you [00:26:00] know, When, when I was at high school, you had to balance check because you didn’t know when that check was going to clear.
You had to make sure you had enough money to cover. And so there was an important role to that. Now it’s like log in. Okay. I have this much money. I’ll come into a quick transfer. Cause I need to have this thing coming out. Like it’s
Adam Cloninger: a free
Chris Gazdik: spirits rationalization,
Adam Cloninger: you can, you can see it a lot easier now.
Chris Gazdik: Plus that is a free spirits rationalization, Adam and stuff. And y’all are like minded. I think we could turn the mics off, talk about it afterwards, but that’s a free, that’s a free spirit rationalization. I don’t think online banking in the way that we do it now has changed very much for people that are like me, the nerds.
We want to know exactly where the money is and what we’re. Down to the penny. I mean, I’ve done this my entire life and I budget super well as a result of that. Like, I mean, we utilize our money. I don’t do debt. You know, it’s like, you know, it’s, and it’s funny, right, to have conversations about that with like, you know, if we were a business, I’d be like, you’re all statements right there [00:27:00] would drive me crazy.
No,
Adam Cloninger: I mean, I know how much is my 401k, I know how much I’m putting in there, I know what kind of rate I’m gonna get, I know what accounts are in, I know how much my pension’s gonna be if I leave at this age and this age, I know
Chris Gazdik: all that stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, we’ll probably have a decent conversation. Yeah, I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t even, I wouldn’t even try, would you?
Just kidding. The questions that we had for this show were, how does finances affect mental health, how to manage finances to improve mental health, and then marriages and finances, is there a connection? And I tried to talk to Evan about that, but he wasn’t down with it, you remember that?
Neil Robinson: Yeah, you, you tried to, you tried to prod him into trying to get some juicy gossip or some crazy story. I was kind of having
Chris Gazdik: fun with it more than
Adam Cloninger: anything, but yeah,
Neil Robinson: no, that was, that was funny. You trying and he’s like, no, I couldn’t, but no, that’s what
they’re listening.
Chris Gazdik: Cause you know that he’s had all kinds of marital challenges that go into a bank when they’re dealing with a loan and they’re all stressed out.
They’re talking to him about, about there’s all kinds of events,
Neil Robinson: I’m sure. [00:28:00] I’m sure. Yeah. And that’s, and he is a little bit younger, so maybe he hasn’t had to deal with them as much as some of the other, but yeah, he did basically pass the buck on that one. Cause you’re like, I’m not going to say anything about it.
Would you pass
Adam Cloninger: the buck too? I’m sure you’ve had people come in and been like, or finances and arguing
Chris Gazdik: about stuff. Oh, it depends on the context in an international podcast. I’ll probably pass the buck. Yeah. There you go. We’re hanging out.
Adam Cloninger: Chris has a new understanding now.
Chris Gazdik: Yeah, there is that. Okay. Shall we dance on a little bit to, well, no, wait a minute.
Where did we land with the finances and mental health? Obviously there are so many correlations between how you’re feeling and your mental health. And how
finances are, are embedded under that you mentioned the stress going in to the, to the bank, but you know, the, the panic that people have, like, it’s interesting.
I just heard the Rogan talking on with Ice Cube, but that was the show I was listening to while I [00:29:00] worked out. Oh, yeah, that was entertaining, interesting to say the least, but they were talking about the first money expenditures that they got. Actually, Ice Cube bought a Honda Acura. That’s what he bought.
His first big purchase is for about 20, 000. And, but what they both talked about is that, that, that weight that’s just burdensome on our shoulders was just lifted when they actually started making real money and People don’t usually get to experience that and that’s one of the reasons. Otherwise, I really like the Dave Ramsey program because he talks about that weight that debt creates, but also the weight of not knowing how you’re going to meet the crisis that comes up.
You know, I’m proud to say we, we, we deal with our finances and don’t make a lot, but you know, kid needed braces and we were able to pay for that by cash. That’s, that’s it. I’m proud of that. You know, that’s not, people aren’t able to usually do that sort of thing. So, so, so living without [00:30:00] that money weight and it dramatically impacts your, your mental health.
Well, the other thing
Neil Robinson: we’re talking about is like how mismanaged money can cause stress, but then stress can cause you to mismanage your money too. Good point. Because that was the other thing. It’s because both ways play off of it. Because if you’re really stressed out. You’re going to go splurge and buy whatever, you know, the Victoria talked about retail therapy at TVMAX, but then you also have the other part where…
Retail therapy? Oh, hell yeah.
Adam Cloninger: Yeah. You ever heard of that? No, but I can relate. Oh, it’s a thing. Not from, not from retail, but from eating. Stressed out, want to eat crap.
Neil Robinson: Oh, yeah. Yeah, when you’re stressed, you just don’t, you don’t budget, you don’t manage, you don’t watch what you eat. It’s that same idea, and then…
Let’s do it. And then the other side of it is, you know, if you don’t have the money, you’re like, I don’t care. I’m getting dead. Anyways, I’ll just go buy more
stuff. It’s like, who cares? You know? So it really, they really do your mental health and your finances really do play off of each other. And it’s, it’s a build
Chris Gazdik: positively together, but they definitely build destructively together.
You’re [00:31:00] right. It was called some sort of fancy thing, symbiotic relationship or something. Do you remember what we called it? I do not remember what it’s called as far as that’s concerned, impact or a double impasse or something like that. That, yeah, that was a good pick because I forgot about that. And then again where we landed was, was Evan’s strong focus on financial literacy.
So let’s move on to set the second show was episode two 44 on emotional freedom. The questions that we really had there were letting go, man, you know, that’s a tough reality power and control issues. Secondly, do you know the serenity prayer? And how it really gets applied, and then I was amazed, Neil, at the third question, you know, what is emotional freedom?
Neither, neither John nor Victoria really ever even thought about it or heard of it. I was very surprised. Emotional freedom? Yeah, yeah. Have you ever heard of this, [00:32:00] even the word combination?
Adam Cloninger: No, I mean,
Chris Gazdik: I was surprised as a therapist, I’ve thought about
Adam Cloninger: this, a term like common term. And yeah,
Chris Gazdik: I’ve thought about that concept a lot and They didn’t and you’ve never
Adam Cloninger: heard of it.
I mean, I’ve never really thought me. I obviously were familiar with both words, but Neil, did you ever hear this
Chris Gazdik: before we did a show that you weren’t on the mic? So I never even asked you,
Neil Robinson: I don’t think I’ve thought of the term. I think I. Cool. Cool. I can’t think of like stoicism or something where you would, that’s almost like to me what emotional freedom is, that idea that you don’t let th
You kind of, but I’ve never, I don’t think I ever thought about the term emotional freedom, but I think it’s a, it’s a great term, you know, cause they use a term like financial freedom or something like that, where it’s like you build enough. You build things up and up that you don’t have to worry about it.
You have your systems in place. And I think emotional freedom is that same thing where you build up your systems. You build yourself up to be able to handle [00:33:00] situations. You know, you’re not triggered by an ex or a child or a spouse and you, you can, you learn how to handle things. Yeah. You see, you
Adam Cloninger: see, yeah, I’m sorry.
Chris Gazdik: I’m, I’m cracking up because we, we got the YouTube comments and gas. I, first of all, she, he says, happy, she says, happy birthday to you, Neil. How
Adam Cloninger: cool is that? Thank you, Cass. And,
Chris Gazdik: She’s busted on you, Nick. Adam, she wants to know if you painted your mower with Rust Oleum. What did you paint your mower with?
The world needs to know. Oh, no,
Adam Cloninger: no. I, I, I, I sprayed it down with a pressure washer and then I used A wire brush and took it down and then I, I took and put rust inhibitor on it and then I primered it and then I used, well I’m not done yet, and then, then I used actual, actual paint from John Deere.
Neil Robinson: So yeah, it’s, it’s done right.
And then, then you clear coated it? Or did, did the John Deere paint have the clear coat?
Adam Cloninger: Wow, that’s a lot. Yeah, and you sand it down, and then between coats you use you use it’s really [00:34:00] not tack cloth, but the, you know, the little sticky, sticky ish wipes you have for like cars, whatever, wipe it down between coats, get the dust off of it, and spray
Neil Robinson: it.
How many coats did you put on it? A few.
Chris Gazdik: Does this thing work now? Yeah. Oh, you did get it back working. Yeah. You told me it was broke.
Adam Cloninger: It’s weird, I mean, the guy came out, And it would work, and then it would stop working, and it would work, and then he replaced the fuse, but, you know, the fuse looks fine, but then the fuse finally blew, put another fuse in it, and it was the fuse?
I think it was like a faulty fuse. I mean, the fuse looked good, and then when it finally blew,
Chris Gazdik: and it was replaced… Definitely done. It, yeah. Okay. And it looks good, dude, doesn’t it? Eh, this
Adam Cloninger: kid’s rough still, but it’s… I mean, considering the thing’s, I don’t know, 12 years old or something like that, it’s…
Chris Gazdik: So, in fairness, she also says students should learn personal finances in high school.
And [00:35:00] absolutely, I would agree with you, Cass. You know, Victoria was talking about that, I think, but but moving on to this personal freedom, emotional freedom. Yeah, I just, I think it’s a cool concept and I’ve, I’ve found Judith Orlov’s words to really say this very well, that it is a roadmap for those who are stressed out, discouraged or overwhelmed as well as for those who are in good emotional place, but want to feel even better.
So it is to turn away from negativity, react. constructively and seize command of any situation. Complete emotional freedom is within your grasp. I, I thought that was, that was a cool way to describe what it is that, that we’re talking about. And I’m shocked that we don’t think about this, you know, more.
Then what it’s talked about. I mean, it’s certainly the result of good therapy, you know, if, if we’re working on depression or anxiety or trauma [00:36:00] or distress of any sort, and we get to a place where we’re managing our emotional system better, we don’t, it’s, it’s, it’s so freeing. Like, cause when you’re trapped in the, the great despair that depression, let’s just say, can create, man, you’re, you’re livin I mean, it’s, it’s suffocating.
And then when you’re, when you’re free from that, or at least freer from that I’m
Adam Cloninger: glad you said that. Right, yeah. Cause I mean, I, to me, from what I’m hearing you saying that this emotional freedom is, it’s like a utopian
thing. I mean, nobody, nobody really has true emotional freedom. I mean, everybody gets upset or angry or, you know, whatever about something.
There’s not, nobody’s like okay.
Chris Gazdik: Well, the absolute of emotions. Yeah. Yeah. That’s, that’s probably true. Maybe that’s why people don’t think about it as much. I mean, it’s, you know, it’s similar to like self actualization with maslow’s. You know, hierarchy. You get to [00:37:00] manage the physical and emotional safety and you get boundaries in love and support and activity and whatever.
The top of the pyramid is like, Oh, you know, I have arrived and self actualized.
Adam Cloninger: You gotta have
Chris Gazdik: a goal. It’s a lot. It’s a lot. And there are variations, so. That’s probably very, very true. Which is also something that we did not talk about during the… The show, I believe. So yeah, that’s, that’s what we’re talking about.
And those are the questions. So if we look at what is it, you know, I was surprised because both Victoria and John knew it, knew what it was and as a result of therapy, but, you know, didn’t know that we were really dealing with that issue. Do you know of the serenity prayer? Neil, I know you do.
Neil Robinson: I think I’ve heard it a few times lately.
Adam Cloninger: Right. Have you ever heard of the serenity prayer?
Chris Gazdik: I have no idea. Oh, it’s absolutely words of complete wisdom. I cite it all the time. You probably,
Adam Cloninger: I probably heard you say something
Chris Gazdik: about it before. No, no, I have. No,
Neil Robinson: no, no, no. To [00:38:00] sum it up, it
basically, it is what it is.
Chris Gazdik: Dang, man. Just, why don’t you just explain your smart alecky response there. Look at this guy on YouTube. Look at his face right there. Oh, I hate that phrase. That is not the serenity prayer. That’s pretty close. By the way,
it is what it is. So, Adam, you know you can do what you do, right? Do what you can
Adam Cloninger: do.
That sounded like it is what it is. Do do. Do
Chris Gazdik: what you can do. So it is what it is, so you do what you can do.
Adam Cloninger: Oh, okay. It’s
Neil Robinson: basically, it’s a short, it’s a paraphrasing of the serenity
Chris Gazdik: prayer. God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change. The courage to change the things that I… And the wisdom to know the difference.
So yeah, of course you’ve heard that, right? It is an amazing three line set. And I think that emotional freedom is all over, you know, when you really get, but who gets the actual wisdom of that? Like how good are people actually at that? Do you think
Adam Cloninger: I’m going to [00:39:00] go with The Jeet Kune Do symbol.
Jeet Kune Do.
On the outside. Having no way is a way, having no limitation is a limitation.
Chris Gazdik: I’m so lost right now. It’s kind of the same
Adam Cloninger: thing. Do you know what he’s talking about?
Neil Robinson: Sounds familiar, but not entirely, but…
Chris Gazdik: Is this like the infinity symbol?
Adam Cloninger: No, no, no, no, no, no, never
Chris Gazdik: mind. Having no way
Adam Cloninger: is no way. Having no way is a way, having no limitation is a limitation.
Chris Gazdik: Having no way is the way. This is the way. Sorry, the Mandalorian reverence. That, okay, that, that hurts my brain a little bit. Yeah, I think we need to move on. It’s just
Adam Cloninger: like adapting and having no limitation and… That’s all it is. That’s all it’s about.
Chris Gazdik: And then when you accept that you have limitations…
Adam Cloninger: There’s no limitation. But there are! There are no limitations. How can there not be
Chris Gazdik: limitations? This is some kind of weird stoicism or mystic belief system. What is this? I’m confused.
Adam Cloninger: If you have an instructor, no matter what it is, Okay. [00:40:00] If you, Math instructor. If you set your, whatever, math instructor. If you set your limit as I’m gonna learn everything they know, then that’s all you’re ever
Chris Gazdik: gonna know.
Okay. So you don’t want to give yourself a limitation because that’s a limitation. Right. So it’s a attitude about how to move forward in life or something, a mentality.
Adam Cloninger: Having no way means if you, and having no limitation has to do with, you use whatever is, works good for you. But if something comes up better, that it works better than you have the, you have the ability to switch and use whatever’s works better.
Chris Gazdik: I like it, but the mindset doesn’t mix with reality totally, which is why I like the serenity prayer because it really is full of reality, but I love the mindset actually. I mean, I kind of am there with you. I try to live that out. Like I don’t like limitations either.
I [00:41:00] like to think out of the box, but the reality of it is. There are definitely things that I cannot control. There are things in emotions, there are things in relationships, there are things in, just in life that, you know, if you try to control things that you can’t control, you’ll drive yourself nuts. So there are real limitations.
There are real problems that you have if you try to do that. So I love, I love what we got on YouTube. Emotional freedom is a lifelong experience. Got to keep working on it. You know, you add to it, you lose it, you know, but you keep on, you know, managing it, striving for it, striving with it. That’s a, it’s a good, it’s a good perspective.
So I do, I use the serenity prayer all the time. And then the other question, letting go, we don’t have time to really go deep into. The idea of, of letting go, but, holy cow. It is what it
Adam Cloninger: is. Right, Neil? It is so much like that. What? Nothing. Nothing. Was this off the air? No, no. He, he’s talking about letting go, and I was like, it is what it
Chris Gazdik: is.
[00:42:00] Oh, yeah. But you gotta do what you can do, so you control the things you can control. That’s the courage. Is he a last word
Neil Robinson: person? Yeah, he’s a topper. But I think… I think the important thing when you look at what she says, you look at the goals that you have, there has to be an intentionality of going towards emotional freedom that, that, that in itself is an intentional process, you know, because if you read, you know, Judy Orloff, that sentence of to turn away from negativity, react constructively.
And seize command of any situation. Like those are you yourself are taking control of the situation. When my kid did karate, the instructor said, you can’t control your feelings, but you can control how you react to them. And that’s the key. There has to be something in your intentionality to want to.
build yourself towards emotional freedom, just like financial freedom, same things. You have to be intentional with it. Letting go. You have to intentionally let go of whatever is driving you crazy. Forgiveness is not about the other person. It’s about you. That’s that whole process. [00:43:00] So that’s what I would say with emotional freedom is there’s an intentionality.
You have to want to want it and you have to push and you actually get to the point where you purposefully react or do certain things to have the emotional freedom, which is incredibly empowering.
Adam Cloninger: Oh,
Chris Gazdik: very much so. Yeah, like, you know, it’s, it’s empowering and that, that goes with the serenity prayer. Like, you know, controlling what you can control.
People really do. I mean, all jokes aside, like to say, you know, it is what it is. It’s a phrase I hear all the time. And but the reason why it does drive me crazy is because it doesn’t match with an empowered attitude. We, we don’t know the difference between that and what we really can do. And I tell you.
From a mental health standpoint, as a therapist, like people are terrified the first session, oftentimes they’re making a huge step to even show up and come because, you know, we do not feel empowered to, to manage the way that we feel and, and man, what amazing it is to see somebody [00:44:00] go through a, a, A therapy experience where you start out at that space totally feeling disempowered and not being able to manage the way that you feel or even know what you feel.
We talked about that to to a to a place where, wow, I know that I’m going to be able to handle a situation. I can stay grounded when the shit really hits the fan. I’m, I’m in a, I’m in a de escalated state, Vicotoria talked about that with a particular philosophy that, that she works with. You’re in your comfort zone, not your stress zone.
So, you know, lots of really cool things there with the concepts of emotional freedom. We need to move on though a little bit just to finish up. Yeah, letting go and forgiveness. I think John did an excellent job of talking about that. And we talked a little bit about the concept of resiliency, which is what we were just mentioning and then needing support systems so that you’re not alone with managing your emotions and having people that you could trust in your corner.
And then, man, we, we agreed, [00:45:00] I think in a real time moment that you can’t have emotional freedom if you don’t have self acceptance, it’s like, it’s impossible. And I think I hadn’t really thought about it that way, but I think that’s that’s a true true statement, closing thoughts emotional freedom attaining it closing thoughts comments And we shall move on and dance to when people hurt us when we’re hurt by others The three questions that we had there were understand shame based feelings again, right?
Understanding blame and understanding what leads to hurt feelings and the emotional pain and how to manage the experience So how did we do on that show? I feel like It’s something that people talk about a lot, Adam. You know, that like, you hurt me or I feel hurt by this, this thing. Right. But I don’t think people really know what it even means to be hurt.
Like, what do they even [00:46:00] mean when they, when they say that? So they don’t really understand
Adam Cloninger: why they’re mad, you’re saying? I
Chris Gazdik: think so. Yeah. Like, if you think about somebody that hurt you. What does that mean? It can mean so many different things, but I don’t know that people are really able to describe what that hurt
Adam Cloninger: is.
I guess you can kind of drive it down to almost like, no matter what it is, it’s almost like a betrayal. That’s a big word. I mean, like, I mean, not, it could be anything that lied to you. You betrayed betrayed my trust, you know, so it’s,
Chris Gazdik: Yeah, no, you’re totally on point. Totally on point. Do you think people are feeling like they’re saying, instead of, hey, you know, Neil, you hurt me, when you, when you said that the other day.
That they’re saying, hey, Neil, I feel betrayed by you when you said that thing the other day. Because I don’t know that people are thinking betrayal. I [00:47:00] don’t know that they’re making that connection. That that’s what’s actually really bothering them. Because you’re right, that’s a, you know, when you’re hurt, betrayal
Adam Cloninger: is a big issue.
They’re thinking at a higher level, like, he did something wrong, not that he did something wrong and I feel betrayed and that’s why I’m angry. Or they’re not thinking of the root
Neil Robinson: cause either. Like, why do I feel hurt? Like, cause if, cause if you say something to your significant other or kids, like, and you You’re critical to them, the fact that you’re critical of them or something like that, then they feel like you’ve, you’ve betrayed that trust or that, that respect they have for you by saying something they didn’t expect to hurt.
Cause I’m trying to think of something not as like, not as far, far fetched as cheating or that, but like obvious betrayals, right? The obvious ones, but like, you know, you know, you tell your wife, you look good in that dress and you come to find out that. She doesn’t. And she’s mad at you now because her friend said she, she looks horrible.
Like
Adam Cloninger: Jeannie said, I look fat. You didn’t tell me I was fat in this [00:48:00] dress.
Chris Gazdik: And so sorry, but, but because they had about a month ago, Adam, that was too real. No, I’m just kidding. I’m just
Neil Robinson: kidding. But see, and that’s the thing is like, it’s something as simple as that. But because of the relationship you have with them there, you betrayed them because.
They expect certain things from you and you
Chris Gazdik: weren’t honest with them, or, well, yeah. You know, honestly, what I think leads to that, and, and I was just, I was listening to you, Neil, and, and, and I’m, I’m landing at a place, and here, here’s where I’m landing. Like yeah. I don’t think Adam, people really realize what they’re saying when they say, Hey, you really hurt me, or whatever.
They’re, they’re not going at the, the, the concept of betrayal or, or the, the confusion that they have or some of the other things we’ll talk about, but I, I think where they go, Neil, is blame. Instead, instead, like, you know, I blame you for the way that I feel, because you said what you said about my dress, and, you know, it’s your fault, like, you, it’s your fault, and, and you, now, even maybe, I believe, purposely, are trying to hurt me when you said what you said, [00:49:00] and I don’t like that, and now we move from, from event, To blame, to now I’m angry and I’m throwing, and man, I tell you, people will throw that back and forth, back and forth,
Adam Cloninger: back and forth.
This is kind of off subject. Have you ever had anybody that gives you non apologies? Oh, yeah. Oh,
Neil Robinson: like, I’m sorry you felt bad about that? Yes. I do that to my wife sometimes. I did that once. Like, pseudo seriously, that was a big mistake. But I’m like, I’m sorry that hurt your feelings. Like,
Adam Cloninger: I’m sorry you misunderstood what I tried to say to you.
I
Chris Gazdik: apologize that you’re a moron, right? Yeah.
Adam Cloninger: It
Chris Gazdik: is a thing. You’re absolutely on point. I don’t think people are being intentional about that, and I think part of what we want to… Begin to, to realize interestingly about fault in the show. We talked about like when somebody did something to you, we’ll really begin to think about like, what, what did I do wrong that caused this or how did I contribute to it?
And, and it’s not about fault, but it’s also not about the other person’s fault sometimes either too, [00:50:00] when it relates to the blame. So like, if you’re criticizing my outfit for the show, Neil, it’s like, ouch, well that hurts, but, you know, why does that hurt? Maybe I have my own feelings about something from long ago that comes into the end of the mix.
I need to manage the way that I’m feeling. Let’s tie emotional freedom into that. Instead of blaming you for being a jerk, or whatever I might put on you for saying what you said about my… You know, my outfit, your red socks. My red socks are cool. It’s a spaceman playing soccer. Red. Yeah. I’m cool socks. I can’t show my, I wear crazy socks.
Now I usually do. I mean, these are not one of them, but you don’t like my socks,
Neil Robinson: man. No, I actually do. I’m just, they, they really stand out. That’s just why I said it, but I think that’s important to understand because there’s things that. I could say the same thing to my wife and it would probably bother her versus if a friend said it or different so it’s just sometimes it’s that The idea about [00:51:00] what they’re thinking the person’s saying or they’re going deep with it.
Like, oh, you said that because you don’t, you don’t respect me or whatever, or there was some argument we had 10 years ago that brought back something and like, Oh boy. So, but I think that’s important because I think understanding where that hurt.
Chris Gazdik: you Adam? No. Oh, okay.
Neil Robinson: I think that’s important. The context of where that hurt comes from and really like, because if she’s hurt by a comment I said, that was affected by something a friend did 30 years ago in high school.
Well, that’s not my fault. You can’t really blame me because I didn’t know that context from 30 years ago And I wasn’t intentionally trying to hurt her and then you have to understand on your side. Why does that trigger me? Why does that cause me to feel this way when it really shouldn’t and then you have to look at what’s the purpose?
You
Chris Gazdik: know, what’s the there’s a lot there, you know, you just took me back to I was looking at our trailer for this Will not defeat me It’s a program that we did for sexual abuse, right? And one of the things that our, our partner in crime that helped us create that was Chris, you know, [00:52:00] talking about asking why.
It’s a really important part of this scenario. Okay, look, so if you’re really listening and following the bouncing ball here, this happens in marriages like a lot, you are going to have a problem with your spouse. And unfortunately, you’re probably not going to really know and understand all about what’s hurting you.
And you’re probably going to blame them. And then as you fight about that or tell them that. They hurt you and it’s their fault. They’re going to get defensive and fire that back at you. And this just snowballs and goes crazy. But we, you know, if we stop, we didn’t talk about this in the show. So this is bonus material, you know, and ask, why am I feeling this way?
Right? Instead of immediately jumping into the blame when you feel some sort of way about being criticized or something that somebody said or, you know, a full on betrayal. Yeah, they may have had an affair, but the emotions that you’re feeling as it [00:53:00] relates to what has happened are a whole lot more about a lot than just that event.
There’s a lot of factors into that, right? And if you ask yourself why or what’s going on with me and get thorough with that, you’re going to get a whole lot more Neil, what you’re talking about. Yeah. And I, and
Neil Robinson: I think we, it’s important to go back. Like this is one small subset, but part of the show was when someone legitimately does something to hurt you, it’s not your fault.
You know, if the, if the guy or the wife goes out and goes drinking and he has an affair, that’s not your fault that they’ve hurt you. Well, there could be some
relationship stuff, but the idea is if domestic violence, if someone’s beating up their significant other, it’s not your fault. You can’t take that in there.
If there’s a lot of stuff that when there is actual negative. Intention behind it from the other person. That’s not your fault. That’s what, and I think that’s what the show was about was when you get hurt, like intentional hurt, not unintentional. Oh, I’m sorry that I said something that triggered you.
Good example.
Chris Gazdik: And I think we talked [00:54:00] about it. If I recall, or maybe I was just thinking about it, but my friend in high school that got stood up, did that come up? I think it did. Yeah. Yeah. She got stood up by my best friend and, and years later, she’s still very much hurt by that. And just holding onto that and like having this resentment, I was like shocked.
It like, this is like five, six years later, she was really bent about that. I’m like, Oh my God. Like, because he stood you up one night that there was more to it was.
Adam Cloninger: She was probably invested in some way, shape, or form, and expecting different,
Chris Gazdik: so, yeah. All sorts of things that go into, like, Okay, so, when you’re feeling hurt, what does that really mean? Stop and ask yourself. That is an awesome therapy question, by the way. For young therapists out there. If you’re stuck on a session, just ask, what does that mean to you?
Yeah, you’ll, you’ll have plenty of exploration that comes from that question. But, but what does that hurt mean to you? [00:55:00] Is it betrayal? Is it that you’re, you got triggered with, with fear and you’re scared about something now? Is there confusion where you thought something was that now seems like it isn’t?
What is this hurt that you’re feeling? You can’t just stop there. So what does this mean to you? And then avoid the blame and the guilt and the shame show. And get at like, okay, well why am I feeling this? What else is contributing to the way that I’m feeling? Then you can figure out action points. And, and make decisions.
What kind of boundaries do I need to set? What kind of actions do I need to take? What kind of decisions are we needing to make, you know, because this
hurt has, has come up. Okay. I just feel like that’s a lot. I, I need to wind down. Is that, is that landing making sense? Yeah. Cause that’s a lot.
Adam Cloninger: Some other people might know the term five wise.
Chris Gazdik: What is that? I
Adam Cloninger: do not. So, basically, it’s, it’s, it’s trying to find the root cause of something. [00:56:00] Something happened. Why?
Chris Gazdik: Oh, yeah, yeah. Go ahead. I know this is awesome stuff. Yeah, yeah,
Adam Cloninger: yeah. I’m with you know I’m a user from a manufacturing standpoint. So,
Chris Gazdik: As we, as you would.
Adam Cloninger: Yeah, yeah. So, I, you know, or, so,
Such and such machine broke down.
Well, why? Well, because the belt broke. Some people would stop. Okay, well, the belt broke. Well, why’d the belt break? Well, because it was supposed to have been replaced after 200 hours. Well, why wasn’t it replaced after 200 hours? It wasn’t on the PM schedule. There it is. There it is.
Neil Robinson: Well, why, why wasn’t it on the PM schedule?
Adam Cloninger: I’m saying that that’s, that’s it. Now, now
Neil Robinson: you’re getting somewhere. So now you can go further with that one. You can blame, you can get to a blame, but, but
Chris Gazdik: you can get to blame. No, you’re, you’re right, you’re right. He wants to get to the blame part, man, you’re, you’re right. You’ve
Adam Cloninger: got to it. So you know, why Was it on PM schedule?
That’s, that’s the problem. So you add it to the PM schedule, and now the problem is from going [00:57:00] forward was resolved. So you don’t have that
same issue. So that’s kind of the same thing. It is. Yeah, go ahead. You dig down to more.
Neil Robinson: There were, there was something else I read, I’m trying to think of where it was, but there was some inspirational speaker, influencer guy, and he talked about like three truths or three truth, you know, three truths.
And so when you get into a situation where you start overreacting, you ask, well, is it true? And you really start digesting what happened. And then. You digest it. Then you say, well, is that true? And you reprocess it again. And then you ask yourself like two, three, four times, because the idea is just like the five why’s you’re diving into what’s going on and you have to reprocess it.
Like really? Why? You know, what’s going on? What really happened? You know, that person cut me off at the grocery store. Well, You know, they were, they were mad at me because I, whatever, they didn’t like the color of my shirt. Well, is that really true? Well, no, they had a bunch of kids and they probably didn’t see me.
Well, like, you have to dive deeper, whether it’s Five Whys, Three Truths, they’re great ways to dig deeper into [00:58:00] really what’s going on.
Chris Gazdik: And you know what sucks? From me who works with this day in and day out, like, I don’t feel like people want to do that. Of course not.
Neil Robinson: Yeah. It’s easier to, it’s easier to live it, live in the hurt, and, and look for pity.
Right. And, and be like, oh, they
Chris Gazdik: hurt me. And assign blame. Like, we shoot that shit out so readily at people, and don’t even think about any of this stuff. And, it’s like, you know. I mean, look at our political system is, is a big piece of all of that. You know, the decisions that we made. Oh, my head hurts already.
It’s oh, right. It’s
Neil Robinson: terrible. They did come up with a common consensus. Did you see that? What? The dress code. They, they had their, Oh, in the Senate? They went from letting a formal dress code because of Fetterman. Because he wore Did they really? Because of
Adam Cloninger: Fetterman? Because he wore shorts and A hoodie?
Neil Robinson: Do they have tank top on? He wears hoodies. He had like shorts the other day on or something. He wears gym shorts and a hoodie. Like that’s his outfit. That’s
Adam Cloninger: awesome
Chris Gazdik: that they got [00:59:00] consensus about that. I mean, yeah, it’s, it’s just, let’s just assign blame. Let’s assign hate. Let’s just let our feelings flow around and throw it around rather than really spend that time with the five why’s or the, the, the myriad of ways that we deal with emotional freedom or the.
Therapy activities of, you know, write your thoughts down and evaluate where it comes from. And, you know, the three truths and, you know, there’s, there are different ways of really getting at it. And I tell you, one of the four things that came out of my book, you know, when I synthesized, you know, how to manage mental health down to four main pieces, one of them was stop and, and evaluate, like, just be aware of emotional reality.
Awareness of your emotional reality is one of the four things that I synthesize down into what’s important about managing your mental health. And daggum it, I just think people don’t do it. And that, that’s unfortunate. It’s a lot of work for
Neil Robinson: some people. And it takes a lot of, just, just, just like [01:00:00] exercising or other stuff, sometimes controlling your emotions is something that, It takes a lot of people.
It just, just like athletics. You got some people who are naturally gifted at athletics. There are people who can handle their emotions overall a lot better than others. And there’s other people that have to work a lot harder and you have to put the effort in. It’s very true.
Chris Gazdik: It’s very true. And, and just to follow that point, it’s an excellent point, Neil, a little bit further the, the reality here is, is that.
Like, let’s just take, for instance, we’ve talked about on the show, borderline personality disorder, you know, one of the ways and one of the basic understandings about that, that I think I understand is that you feel emotional realities way more intensely than is typical. Like happy is really happy.
Scared is really scared. Anger and irritability is really irritability. Like it’s, you see what I mean? Like it’s exemplified, whatever it is that you’re feeling. And so somebody that has borderline personality disorder through no fault of their own
[01:01:00] has a way more difficult job managing their, their feelings and mental health.
And, and that sucks, but I think you’re right. There are other people that are pretty level. Don’t have a
Neil Robinson: lot. Everyone’s personality is different. So Cash responded with a really good statement. Do people really Do people really have the time to analyze a hurt, especially when it happens? Don’t think so.
Put it on a pile of hurts. And I think Oh, put it on a pile of hurts. I think that’s a great statement. And I think the goal that we’re kind of talking about through this whole process is, in the moment it’s a lot to take in. The goal is that if you let that hurt continue to, to dig into you, it is going to just eat at you, eat at you.
And that’s where, that’s when the time comes through to process it, to address it, like in the moment you’re going to feel it and it’s going to be raw and it’s going to hurt and it’s good. If you, if you have other hurts from before that you don’t address. Yeah. It’s going to become a bigger, bigger pile.
You ever treat you, [01:02:00] you get pile of laundry. How long does it take to get through that pile of laundry versus if you do it every week?
Chris Gazdik: You know, there’s a good example. You just pile them up in the sink. Or do you rinse them off and immediately take care of them? It’s yeah, because you pile up too much. You can’t
Adam Cloninger: even rinse them off anymore.
Chris Gazdik: You can’t
Adam Cloninger: You can’t even rinse them off anymore,
Chris Gazdik: you know this Adam it is and and that’s a great it is a great metaphor For, for emotions, because you can’t really even make sense out of them after you had a pile of hurt after hurt after hurt. And then we really do unwind a lot of that in, in therapy. It isn’t usually one simple event in the way that you felt that.
And let’s kind of wind that back. It’s. As Cass points out, it is a pile of hurts that we have to weed through and really get at, like, well, how do these things contribute to each other and how do we unwind them so that we can get to, you know, a place of more empowerment and emotional freedom? It’s good stuff.
And it is, again, amazing to watch people go [01:03:00] through that, that process. I think we had a… a pretty good month in September, you know, there’s some neat shows. I feel like they were, that were pulled together. I like them. They were good this month. Hurts and emotional freedom, you know, like it was purposely tied together.
Where, where shall we go next? Neil? What do you, what do you want to hear about this week, Adam, this month? It’s an interesting thing. Maybe that’s something we should add, man. You, you get to determine that might be good. That’d be kind of be fun. Would it?
Adam Cloninger: Yeah. Let me, let me think on some stuff. Think about
Chris Gazdik: that here at the end.
You give us like a, a, a, a mandate. Maybe, maybe
Adam Cloninger: I can add that to the end of the rabbit hole thing.
Neil Robinson: You, you, you can plan that for November. You can dictate
Adam Cloninger: on November. Exactly.
Chris Gazdik: Play, play around with that. Adam’s, Adam’s mandate. And we’ll maybe see if we cover it. Mandate. Mandate. Wait, hang
Adam Cloninger: on. What? Too much?
That’s weird. Do something on the oxytocin stuff. About the, you know, getting the fix
Neil Robinson: for… The rage rooms, the MMA, the… Yeah, I [01:04:00] mean, you… You’ve mentioned the Rage Room, you thought it was a
Adam Cloninger: great idea, there’s people that didn’t like it, I know we talked about Rage Rooms and stuff before, but I’m sure there’s, you know,
Chris Gazdik: oxytocin…
Oxytocin dumps, where are our
Neil Robinson: oxytocin dumps? We need to do a show dressed in armor, you know, to start throwing weapons at each other
Chris Gazdik: mid show. Holy cow, I don’t know if John’s gonna dance with that very well, man. He’s too peace loving. Be
Neil Robinson: our next month in
Chris Gazdik: review. Victoria and I will throw down, but I think John’s…
John will be the, the, the mature adult in the room calming us down, so. Nah. Closing thoughts, comments, guys. I think it’s about time we get out of here. What you thinking? Closing thoughts, comments. I’ll
Adam Cloninger: try to not have a violent topic next time.
Neil Robinson: I think about everyone has been some sort of a violence related topic, I feel like, every time.
We need,
Chris Gazdik: we need peace and love, man. Let’s, let’s find some, yeah, let’s, let’s, let’s find some peace and love current event or bunny rabbit hole. We’ll have a, we’ll have a love for all rabbit hole next, next week, next month. Tune in. Alright, my [01:05:00] brain’s tired, guys. I hope you have a great week. We’re coming up in the fall here.
Wonderful weather in our area. I hope that as the holidays are approaching, you guys take care and find some emotional freedom. Deal with hurts and, of course, be wealthy. Take care. We’ll see you next week, guys.